August 2016 - Talk - lists.gtalug.org

GUI for Ubuntu 16.04
by Stephen 04 Aug '16

04 Aug '16

I have been running 14.04 and have no reason to upgrade. But I am being prompted when updates are performed. I prefer the tradition Gnome interface with a menu bar at the top. I dislike tile based stuff. I have Googled trying to find if I can get my preferred interface in 16.04 but I cannot see the topic addressed. All I see are demos for the new interface. So I am turning here and hope someone can me find out if/how I can use the traditional menu bar. Cheers -- Stephen

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FCC "forces" TP-Link to enable open source on their router(s)
by D. Hugh Redelmeier 03 Aug '16

03 Aug '16

<http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/08/fcc-forces-tp-link-to…> I don't quite get it. The FCC made a rule that was easy to comply with if the manufacturers prevented loading of third party firmware. (The rule: don't let you user set the router to use too much signal strength.) TP-Link's new firmware "could not" be replaced by 3rd party firmware. That firmware also allowed out-of-spec signal strength. As a settlement, FCC required TP-Link to pay a fine, to allow third party software, and to update the firmware to not allow the user to specify (through the GUI) too much signal strength. So the original problem remains: how can TP-Link prevent existing hardware from generating too strong signals if it cannot control the firmware?

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Android <--> KDE = KDE Connect
by William Park 03 Aug '16

03 Aug '16

Something I discovered recently... KDE Connect. - install "KDE Connect" app on Android phone. - modern KDE desktop should come with "KDE Connect" (System Settings | Hardware). It "pairs" Android phone and KDE desktop together, so that you can - remote control mouse/keyboard from phone. When you type on the phone or touch the screen, it shows up as keystrokes or mouse movement on desktop, respectively. - transfer files from phone to desktop. - transfer files from desktop to phone. Unfortunately, it doesn't work on Slackware, but works on Kubuntu and KaOS. -- William

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Advice -- Building Debian 8 PC To Replace Win XP PC;
by Steve Petrie, P.Eng. 02 Aug '16

02 Aug '16

Warm Greetings To GTALUG, Please forgive the long email. -- have to provide some background. BACKGROUND -- BUILDING DEBIAN 8 PC TO REPLACE WIN XP PC I'm working to replace an old Dell Windows XP SP3 PC with a new PC, booting Debian Linux 8 as the primary OS, with Win 7 set up to run under QEMU / KVM vbirtualization under Debian. A multi-boot setup will allow booting Windows 7 (OEM) on bare metal, if required for occasional use. I definitely am NOT going to use MS Windows as the primary OS in my new desktop PC !! I have almost no Linux / Unix experience. Some years ago doing application programming on IBM AIX / Korn shell and now for personal and business uses, getting into Debian Linux (and DragonFlyBSD) on cloud-hosted QEMU / KVM virtualization servers. However I do have a strong IT background. (I'm a "retired" software engineer). On 7 January 2016 I sent an inquiry email to hi(a)gtalug.org and Myles Braithwaite responded instantly with helpfull suggestions for which I was very grateful. Myles also encouraged to join the talk(a)gtalug.org mailing list and so now here I am. I'm looking for advice from GTALUG members on two issues: 1. Comments on my proposed PC configuration. I have already researched components and developed a detailed hardware configuration for the new PC. Please see below. This configuration is not yet published on ca.partpicker.com. 2. Advice on how to get the PC built from components, that I will purchase retail and supply to the builder. Here, one option I propose is for a "creative" solution from GTALUG (see point 3, next section). * * * * * * HOW TO BUILD THE NEW DEBIAN 8 PC ? It seems to me that there are three approaches I could take, to get this new PC built: 1. BUILD IT MYSELF. I can handle purchasing all the components. However, although I am comfortable messing around inside the case of a computer, I've never build one from components. I would prefer to have the PC assembled by more experienced hands that have the skills and use of the right tools. So building myself is a last resort. 2. USE A COMMERCIAL PC SYSTEM BUILDER. Any suggestions from mailing list participants, on commercial PC builders would be gratefully received. However, I do not want to have to deal with import hassles, so the builder must be operating in Canada.(preferably in the GTA) Problem: It seems it will be difficult to interest commercial PC bulders in Canada to supply a competitively-priced PC configured with Linux. So if I use a commercial builder, the plan would be to get the PC built and delivered with with Windows 7 only installed, but have a multi-boot setup. After I get the PC I will install Debian 8 Linux as the primary host operating system, and then install Win 7 to run under QEMU / KVM virtualization under Debian. 3. *** CREATIVE IDEA FOR GTALUG *** Perhaps there is a member (or members) of GTALUG who would be able to build the PC from comnponents I supply. Naturally I would be happy to pay a fee for this service Or (and this would be my preference) perhaps GTALUG would be interested in taking on the buuild project as a club project. I expect I would be much more happy to pay money to GTALUG for helping with the build, and to get the pleasure of working with GTALUG, than I would be paying and dealing with a commercial builder. Since I live in Oakville in a small apartment, it would make more sense for the build to happen in Toronto. >From my casual research, there are many Win XP "orphans" like me out there. Not only older-type people stuck on Win XP and wondering what to do before their old PC dies. But also there are plenty of small businesses still running XP (in fact there are probably more small business XP users left, than consumer XP users). You could consider me in a sense, a "poster senior" for a class of people, among whom some could possibly go the Linux route as they migrate away from Win XP. If only these poster seniors (or small business Win XP "orphans") had a helping hand from e.g. GTALUG. For example, run a kind of GTALUG "clinic" that Win XP "orphans" could come to (for a fee) and there work with GTALUG members to get their Linux PC built. And later get their data (e.g. emails) converted over to e.g. Thunderbird. Just a thought, for a way that GTALUG could get more involved with the wider community. And perhaps also pull in some club revenue to support GTALUG initiatives. Perhsps this is an idea the GTALUG Board could consider. I am happy to discuss the idea of being the "guinea pig" for such a project. * * * * * * PROPOSED PC CONFIGURATION Thsi is decidedly NOT a gamer's PC. It is intended to be an ultra-reliable, powerful, fast professional / small business workstation . There is no overclocking. There are no add-in graphics cards. It uses established CPU technology now being price-discounted because of the introduction of new CPU technology. ----------------- ----------------- CPU Intel 4-Core i5-4460 3.2GHz Processor, 64-bit, 6 MB cache, max 32 GB RAM, HD graphics; CPU Cooler Noctua NH-U12S 55.0 CFM CPU Cooler, height w/fan 158mm, clears RAM & PCIe, PWM control; Motherboard ASRock Z97 EXTREME6 ATX LGA1150 Mainboard, PCIe: 2x 3.0x16, 1x 2.0x16, 2x 2.0x1, 1x mini, Ultra M.2 Gen3 8Gb/s x4 (uses 4x PCIe 3.0 CPU socket lanes), extra large heat sinks; Memory Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3-1600 RAM, 1.35 volt, timings 8-8-8-24; ----------------- Case Fractal Design Define R5 (Black) ATX Mid Tower Case, 3-speed fan control (max 3 fans), bays: fan 9, drive: 2x5.25", 8x3.5", 2xSSD, CPU cooler height max 180mm, 2 dust filters; Power Supply EVGA SuperNOVA P2 850W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply; ----------------- Solid State Drive Samsung SM951 128GB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive, AHCI PCIe Gen3 8Gb/s x4, 256 MB cache, P/N MZHPV128HDGM; Hard Drive Western Digital Caviar Blue Internal Hard Drive 750GB 3.5" 7200RPM 6Gb/s SATA 64MB cache; Optical Drive LG WH16NS40 Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer, SATA, 2/3/4 layers (128GB), 4MB data buffer; ----------------- Video Monitor LG 22MB35DM-I 21.5" Monitor Full HD 1080p 1920x1080 IPS LED Back-lit, DVI-D, D-Sub, contrast ratios: (static 1,000:1), (dynamic 5M:1), reader mode, flicker-safe; Keyboard Dell SK-8110 PS/2 Keyboard, PS/2 Interface, Black, DP/N 07N242, 104 keys, cable with purple 6 pin mini-DIN male (PS/2 STYLE) connector; Mouse Logitech SBF-96 PS/2 Wired Optical Mouse, 3 Buttons, wheel, cable with green 6 pin mini-DIN male (PS/2 STYLE) connector; ----------------- Dialup Modem US Robotics USR5638 56K* V.92, internal dial-up faxmodem card, (PCIe) PCI Express x1; ----------------- ----------------- Multi-Boot Main Host OS O/S Debian 8 LXDE Linux -- x86_64 (QEMU / KVM host o/s to Win7 x86_64 guest o/s); ISO on DVD (standard Debian installation ISO **NOT LIVE installation ISO**); Guest OS Microsoft Windows 7 Professional Full, 32/64-bit, from ISO on DVD (guest o/s of Deb8); Emergency OS Microsoft Windows 7 Professional Full, 32/64-bit, ISO on DVD (emergency multi-boot); ----------------- ----------------- Cables @@@??? Power Bar @@@??? ----------------- ----------------- The same configuratiton is attached as a PDF <ca.pcpartpicker.com -- deb8_win7_dual-boot_PC_business_24_7_duty - summary_bare - Steve_Petrie - 20160313.pdf>. For simplicity, I have omitted mention of: a SCSI controller, and a SCSI tape drive, and speakers. All of which I will acquire later, after the base PC is working. * * * * * * Many thanks to list members for taking the time to consider my email. Comments, questions welcome: 1. On the proposed PC configuration, 2. On the idea of GTALUG helping with the build project. Best Regards, Steve * * * Steve Petrie, P.Eng. ITS-ETO Consortium Oakville, Ontario, Canada (905) 847-3253 apetrie(a)aspetrie.net

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Re: [GTALUG] Advice -- Building Debian 8 PC To Replace Win XP PC;
by Steve Petrie, P.Eng. 02 Aug '16

02 Aug '16

Thanks to GTALUG Members, for the last series of emails I fetched on this thread. Many useful ideas and much interesting info. Copious snippets have been carefully collected into a text file. * * * * * * I have reviewed the quotation I received from NCIX, and can report: 1. Contrary to my earlier assertion, NCIX in fact has included an item for: Microsoft Windows 7 Professional Edition 64Bit DVD SP1 OEM Price C$187.99 [Reg. C$214.98] 2. And the the (now corrected) NCIX total price for hardware components alone, seems reasonable: NCIX: $1593.13 PCPartPicker: $1517.98 Caution: NCIX has made some hardware substitutions, so the total prices are only generically comparable. I compared the sum of component prices, NCIX versus PCPartPicker, and NCIX is acceptably close to PCPartPicker. Here is a summary of the component price comparison (all prices $C): ----------------- NCIX* PC PartPicker** ----------------- -------- ------------- CPU $269.99 $249.25 CPU Cooler $92.98 $79.95 Motherboard $289.99 $228.98 Memory $44.99 $75.98 ----------------- Case $144.99 $129.99 Power Supply $214.98 $159.99 ----------------- Solid State Drive $135.70 $156.99 Hard Drive $67.99 $81.95 Optical Drive $92.98 $86.98 ----------------- Video Monitor $167.98 $167.92 Keyboard $15.98 $40.00 Mouse (incl.) $10.00 ----------------- Dialup Modem $54.58 $50.00 ----------------- ----------------- TOTAL1: $1593.13 $1517.98 ----------------- ----------------- MS Windows 7 $187.99 Assemble & Test $49.98 Environ. Fees $16.65 ----------------- ----------------- TOTAL2: $1897.73 ----------------- ----------------- Not an inexpensive PC. And not a souped-up gamer's PC. But one that I believe will run plenty fast and stay cool under 24/7 duty. With lots of expansion capacity for additional hardware, that will not stress the power supply or the cooling apparatus. My plan now is to revise the Linux PC specification, taking into account the avalanche of advice I have received from GTALUG members. (e.g. increase RAM to 16 GB from 8, drop the dial-up modem and source later, change HDD to Western Digital Black, etc.) Then I will ask NCIX for a revised quotation, confirm with NCIX a number of picky details (e.g. is the WIndows 7 DVD SP1 OEM at the latest SP level?, etc.) and get NCIX agreement on technical details of HDD partitioning (GPT) and boot setup (multi-boot, with Windows 7 installed; ready for a Linux (debian 8) drop-in installation. * * * * * * I'm probably not going to be able respond to many more individual posts to this thread, but I will read any that follow with interest. Will report back, upon conclusion of my negotiations with NCIX. The self-build option for the new Linux PC remains open, should NCIX be unable to satisfy the requirements. Many thanks again to GTALUG !! Best Regards, Steve * * * Steve Petrie, P.Eng. ITS-ETO Consortium Oakville, Ontario, Canada (905) 847-3253 apetrie(a)aspetrie.net

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[GTALUG-Announce] GTALUG meeting on 9th August
by Myles Braithwaite 02 Aug '16

02 Aug '16

<http://gtalug.org/meeting/2016-08/> # On Disruption & Killer Apps with Scott Elcomb There'll be a short half-hour presentation on the history of Atomic OS and related improvements in web technology since the last release. The presentation will then be followed by an interactive session to discuss philosophical questions surrounding disruption, the meaning of "success" in the context of FOSS projects and whether "killer applications" for such projects are important. ## Location George Vari Engineering and Computing Centre 245 Church Street, Room 203 Ryerson University <http://goo.gl/maps/16oJ2> <http://www.openstreetmap.org/way/23447525> ## Schedule * 6:00 pm - Please discuss on the general mailing list (i.e. <talk(a)gtalug.org>) where you want to go for dinner. * 7:30 pm - Meeting and presentation. * 9:00 pm - After each meeting, a group of GTALUGers move to The Imperial Pub (54 Dundas St East) for refreshments and more socialising. # Code of Conduct We want a productive happy community that can welcome new ideas, improve every process every year, and foster collaboration between individuals with differing needs, interests and skills. We gain strength from diversity, and actively seek participation from those who enhance it. This code of conduct exists to ensure that diverse groups collaborate to mutual advantage and enjoyment. We will challenge prejudice that could jeopardise the participation of any person in the community. The Code of Conduct governs how we behave in public or in private whenever the Linux community will be judged by our actions. We expect it to be honoured by everyone who represents the community officially or informally, claims affiliation or participates directly. It applies to activities online or offline. We invite anybody to participate. Our community is open. Please read more about the GTALUG Code of Conduct here: <http://gtalug.org/about/code-of-conduct/>. If you have any questions, comments, or concerns about the GTALUG Code of Conduct please contact the GTALUG Board @ <board(a)gtalug.org>. --- GTALUG Announce mailing list announce(a)gtalug.org https://gtalug.org/mailman/listinfo/announce

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Re: [GTALUG] GTALUG - BUILDING DEBIAN 8 PC TO REPLACE WIN XP PC
by Steve Petrie, P.Eng. 02 Aug '16

02 Aug '16

Hello Stan, Thanks for your response. My comments are inline below. Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stan Witkowski" <stan(a)stanwitkowski.com> To: "Steve Petrie, P.Eng." <apetrie(a)aspetrie.net> Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2016 12:02 AM Subject: GTALUG - BUILDING DEBIAN 8 PC TO REPLACE WIN XP PC > > > I suggest: > <snip> > > 2. Unless you have a specific need (MUST HAVE backup for stock market > trading, for example), > don't install a dial-up modem. Why? (Everything is Internet > based...) > Mainly because I use dial-upon the Win XP system, and I don't want the hassle of changing it to use DSL, before I get the new Linux PC. Also, I'm curious to see if the experience with dial-up is better on Linux than on Win XP. I do plan, after the Linux PC is operational, to switch to DSL. > 3. Install as much RAM as you can afford. (This also allows the use > of a ramdisk, > which can give you VASTLY faster access.) > Personally I would not build a system with under 16 GB RAM, and > better, 32 GB. > Others have mentioned this too. Makes good sense. I will change the spec to 16 GB and assure expandability to 32 GB. > > re: > Hard Drive Western Digital Caviar Blue Internal Hard Drive > 750GB 3.5" 7200RPM 6Gb/s SATA 64MB cache; > > IMPORTANT: I used Western Digital Green drives (and now their > replacement, the Blue) > ONLY AS BACKUP DRIVES!!! These are "environmentally > friendly", > meaning they will spin down down after a short interval > (2 - 3 minutes) > if there is no access to them, to save on electricity. > THIS IS BAD IN A WORKING SYSTEM!!! > > They are perfect as external **ARCHIVE** drives (you write > a bunch of stuff > to them for archival use once an hour, say), but as daily > use drives > they can be a disaster. > > Example: The drive is written to, and spins down. A few > minutes later > it is accessed again, and so spins up. > Down/up/down/up............. > > Better: Western Digital Black drives = more expensize, but also > tougher, etc. > Advice worth it's wait in gold !! I'll look at the Western Digital Black drives. > Stan. > > (I'm moving in a week and hence am surrounded by packing and chaos > <grin>, so any > replies may be spotty...) > I saw no "spots" ... Please accept my extra thanks for taking time out from your move, to advise me. > > (I'll follow your progress - may go the same or similar route at some > point later.) > Stay tuned ...

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Re: [GTALUG] UEFI adventures [was Re: Advice -- Building Debian 8 PC To Replace Win XP PC; ]
by Russell Reiter 02 Aug '16

02 Aug '16

On Aug 1, 2016 1:06 PM, "D. Hugh Redelmeier via talk" <talk(a)gtalug.org> wrote: > > | From: "Steve Petrie, P.Eng. via talk" <talk(a)gtalug.org> > > | ----- Original Message ----- From: "o1bigtenor" <o1bigtenor(a)gmail.com> > <snip the Iliad> > > You really want to be able to do this stuff yourself so that you can > recover from system failures. What better way to learn than before > you have anything important on your system? > > | To add complication, I would like, once the new PC is booting debian Linux > | from the HDD onto bare metal, to imrove performance by providing for debian to > | boot (mostly) from a "shadow" copy on the HDD, and then do all subsequent > | dynamic loading of debian components, from the SSD. LSBinit which debian is now using, provides finer grained control of exit status, I guess this is in part for better daisy chaining in runlevel telemetry initialization. Shadow booting. Sounds like a job for ILP & VLIW, but those 3.1 billion transistors = $5000, that and limited PCI support keep that stuff out of my realm. > > I generally consider my OS disposable. My feelings as well. When I start afresh on a system I usually take it for a configuration test drive before I clone the base. I think that's the one habit I kept from my early M$ days. So I keep it on the SSD. That > makes it much more resposive. No backup: I can easily recreate it. > > I lean towards keeping my data on the HDD. I don't do data-intensive > things. Backing it up is important. > > SSD failures seem to be more sudden that HDD failures. Flakey power at my place keeps me from using SSD's internally. Maybe it's time to hack the sub panel in my apt and do some line conditioning. > --- > Talk Mailing List > talk(a)gtalug.org > https://gtalug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk Russell Sent from mobile.

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Re: [GTALUG] gmane.org gone, at least for now
by Russell Reiter 01 Aug '16

01 Aug '16

On Aug 1, 2016 1:36 AM, "ac via talk" <talk(a)gtalug.org> wrote: > > On Sun, 31 Jul 2016 14:09:34 -0400 > Russell Reiter <rreiter91(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > <snip> > > > Soo, am thinking, in your case... > > > motherboard... --> bios? Is xHCI hand-off enabled in bios settings? > > > (we are using intel... - also, btw eHCI hand-off should be disabled) > > > or still usb 3 issue, passthrough? > > > other than that it sounds like a frustrating and entertaining > > > problem (although it is solved for everyone else afaict :) ) > > > I'm not sure this is a real solution but this guy plugged in a USB 2 > > device in the 3.0 port on boot and it initialized the port as 2.0. > > http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=101903 > > This could work also, cool easy solution Russel :) > > afaict the original problem was solved when the endpoint was recalculated > each time (sync xhci), so if not resolved then it should be something > else, like bios, usb 3 pass, etc - to reconf as usb 2 should also work? > I think flash drives might be more flexible than the scanner. I usually have to fix xsanes internal ordering with a UDEV rule. Perhaps you only need to send ^U in usb setup packets and subsequent block endpoints will toggle correctly. Can't find my link to that tidbit but there is this; "Re: USB scanner stops working with xhci_hcd URB transfer length is wrong, xHC issue? req. len = 0, act. len = 4294967288" https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!topic/linux.kernel/W1OQjJG2nEs Russell Sent from mobile.

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Re: [GTALUG] gmane.org gone, at least for now
by Russell Reiter 01 Aug '16

01 Aug '16

<snip> > https://web.archive.org/web/20150727001119/http://spark.crystalorb.net/mike… > and the reconfiguring of the endpoint solved the problem... > Hmm, my mobile says this: Wayback Machine doesn't have that page archived. > Soo, am thinking, in your case... > motherboard... --> bios? Is xHCI hand-off enabled in bios settings? > (we are using intel... - also, btw eHCI hand-off should be disabled) > or still usb 3 issue, passthrough? > > other than that it sounds like a frustrating and entertaining problem > (although it is solved for everyone else afaict :) ) I'm not sure this is a real solution but this guy plugged in a USB 2 device in the 3.0 port on boot and it initialized the port as 2.0. http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=101903 > > Andre > --- > Talk Mailing List > talk(a)gtalug.org > https://gtalug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk

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