looking for a general purpose boot media to keep in case of distasters
I'd really like to have a good USB key to boot from when some kind of problem happens. Typically I use whatever installation media is lying around but they have really limited tools available. Not to mention tres obnoxious defaults like transparent terminals. Drive me nuts when some catastrophe is going on and the terminal is resetting to 50% opacity at every reboot. Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand. My research tells me that by booting from USB media, it's possible to install on a connected drive of any sort. Normally you use the internal hd but can use another external drive. Then you have a persistent bootable USB where you can install stuff + store files. *However* it is unique to that device so it'd be required to set up a USB key for each one. Not ideal although possibly worthwhile for the main computer. Any advice on this issue? Seems like I wouldn't have been the first person to have this idea. Is it a bad idea? Why? If not, how to set up?
On 9/19/23 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
I'd really like to have a good USB key to boot from when some kind of problem happens. Typically I use whatever installation media is lying around but they have really limited tools available. Not to mention tres obnoxious defaults like transparent terminals. Drive me nuts when some catastrophe is going on and the terminal is resetting to 50% opacity at every reboot.
Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand.
My research tells me that by booting from USB media, it's possible to install on a connected drive of any sort. Normally you use the internal hd but can use another external drive. Then you have a persistent bootable USB where you can install stuff + store files. *However* it is unique to that device so it'd be required to set up a USB key for each one. Not ideal although possibly worthwhile for the main computer.
Any advice on this issue? Seems like I wouldn't have been the first person to have this idea. Is it a bad idea? Why? If not, how to set up?
Hi, There are a variety of repair distributions out there. Seems one good one at least from memory is: https://www.supergrubdisk.org/rescatux/. I've not tried it but seems to maybe be what you require. Nick
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Thanks that could be useful. I will give it a spin. Gparted is indeed one of those tools who's absence can be problematic. Some of the install media include it and some don't. I tried looking to see if there was some kind of stand alone binary gparted I could keep on hand, like a windows portable exe file. Nothing that I found. Maybe you'd need to use one of those formats like appimage? On Tue, Sep 19, 2023, at 11:28 PM, Nicholas Krause wrote:
There are a variety of repair distributions out there. Seems one good one at least from memory is: https://www.supergrubdisk.org/rescatux/. I've not tried it but seems to maybe be what you require.
1. I use what I'm used to. That's Fedora. 2. I don't plan ahead, so I just use the Fedora live installation medium 3. Your distro is probably as good as Fedora. 4. Yes, you can install to a USB drive and have that drive function as an emergency tool. But I find that I don't use the emergency tool enough to be worth that investment in time. The main advantage is that you can make changes to the system and they persist. 6. What I miss on the Fedora live installation medium: - gparted - my private SSH keys - my notes files 7. My Fedora Live Installation stick has lots of free space. I've never figured out whether I could add a file-system to store persistent state. 8. There are systems to allow multiple installation images (.iso) to live on a single stick. I haven't tried ventoy.
On Wed, Sep 20, 2023 at 1:56 AM D. Hugh Redelmeier via talk <talk@gtalug.org> wrote:
1. I use what I'm used to. That's Fedora.
2. I don't plan ahead, so I just use the Fedora live installation medium
3. Your distro is probably as good as Fedora.
4. Yes, you can install to a USB drive and have that drive function as an emergency tool. But I find that I don't use the emergency tool enough to be worth that investment in time.
The main advantage is that you can make changes to the system and they persist.
6. What I miss on the Fedora live installation medium: - gparted - my private SSH keys - my notes files
7. My Fedora Live Installation stick has lots of free space. I've never figured out whether I could add a file-system to store persistent state.
8. There are systems to allow multiple installation images (.iso) to live on a single stick. I haven't tried ventoy. ---
I have found "SystemRescueDisc" (IIRC the actual name) to be a most wonderful tool in this kind of situation. Included is gparted - - - one would have to add one's own keys and files though. I first started using this on a CD, think I have a copy on stick somewhere. (Should make sure to either find it or create another!) HTH
https://www.system-rescue.org This is a likely candidate https://www.system-rescue.org/System-tools Has a lot of the system tools that might be needed https://www.system-rescue.org/manual/Installing_packages_with_pacman You can even add packages https://www.system-rescue.org/manual/Creating_a_backing_store/ And it has some kind of persistent storage though I am unsure what limits would be I am surprised to see it is arch-based with arch repos/AUR via pacman/helper. My experience with manjaro using it in the past year or so is that you need to be constantly updating it as per the "rolling release model". If updates are neglected you will run into some big mess. I don't find any comment on the distro choice in the docs. But since a rescue disk is something you would (hopefully!) have lying around for ages without need for it, it seems like using arch would introduce a lot of potential chaos. I was anticipating some kind of LTS debian etc for this kind of use case. Other than that, looks perfect. Anyone have thoughts on the arch thing? On Wed, Sep 20, 2023, at 6:51 AM, o1bigtenor via talk wrote:
I have found "SystemRescueDisc" (IIRC the actual name) to be a most wonderful tool in this kind of situation. Included is gparted - - - one would have to add one's own keys and files though. I first started using this on a CD, think I have a copy on stick somewhere. (Should make sure to either find it or create another!)
On 2023-09-19 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand.
Some distros have live images. I know openSUSE does. https://download.opensuse.org/distribution/leap/15.4/live/
On Wed, Sep 20, 2023 at 08:22:28AM -0400, James Knott via talk wrote:
On 2023-09-19 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand.
Some distros have live images. I know openSUSE does.
Debian also publishes live images: https://www.debian.org/CD/live/
Is there a distinction between a "live image" and the USB installer? I think we are talking about the same thing; maybe I used inaccurate language. Does this OpenSUSE image come with a broad range of tools? The debian, ubuntu, manjaro and others I have lying around are just the very basics. Am often missing something needed. On Wed, Sep 20, 2023, at 8:22 AM, James Knott via talk wrote:
On 2023-09-19 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand.
Some distros have live images. I know openSUSE does.
https://download.opensuse.org/distribution/leap/15.4/live/ --- Post to this mailing list talk@gtalug.org Unsubscribe from this mailing list https://gtalug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk
On Wed, Sep 20, 2023 at 01:02:28PM -0400, bitmap via talk wrote:
Is there a distinction between a "live image" and the USB installer? I think we are talking about the same thing; maybe I used inaccurate language.
In general, an installer will do nothing more than install a new system. Most will probably have some shell access available to be able to do some stuff outside of the installation, but usually only related to the installation. It is limited as you say. A live system gives you a complete working system that runs off the USB key/CD/etc that you burned it to and memory, rather than the permanent storage of the computer. Many live systems will also permit you to subsequently install them to the permanent storage of the computer, but you are not required to.
Does this OpenSUSE image come with a broad range of tools? The debian, ubuntu, manjaro and others I have lying around are just the very basics. Am often missing something needed.
Anything that you need that isn't on the live system can be easily installed if it's packaged for Debian. It's a full system, so you can also download and compile something that isn't packaged in Debian if you need to do so. -- joeDoe
| From: joeDoe via talk <talk@gtalug.org> | Anything that you need that isn't on the live system can be easily installed | if it's packaged for Debian. It's a full system, so you can also download | and compile something that isn't packaged in Debian if you need to do so. To install gparted on the currently running live Fedora system, I just type this into a terminal window: sudo dnf install gparted On debian and descendants, it should be (UNTESTED): sudo apt install gparted - this requires internet connectivity. I usually use a wired connection so that I don't have to bother with a WiFi password. - You could supply the gparted RPM in another way (eg. on another stick) but you may find that there are dependencies on as-yet-uninstalled packages. Starts to get to be work. - the live system is generally way behind on current updates. You probably don't want to waste your time applying them since they will be washed away once you shut down the live system - if your live system and the system on the hard drive are very different, there is a slight chance that the file systems are slightly incompatible. I hate worrying about that so I try to match the OSes. ================ I've previously said the following on this list; feel free to skip. When I get a computer preloaded with Windows, I immediately shrink the main Windows partition 100G (used to be 64G but I recently bumped into Windows 11 Update failures at that size). gparted is great but not perfect at resizing NTFS filesystems (the Windows native file system). After resizing an NTFS filesystem with gparted, the first thing you should do is boot Windows. Windows will then complete or repair the resizing done by gparted. Superstition: I have had cases where I didn't immediately boot into Windows after a gparted resizing. Sometime Windows won't boot after that. Why use gparted instead of Windows' own resizing tool? Because you cannot reduce the size to less than 50% of the original size with the Window tool. Why? Because there is metadata smack in the middle of the volume and it is marked unmovable. gparted is willing to move it anyway.
bitmap via talk wrote on 2023-09-20 10:02:
Does this OpenSUSE image come with a broad range of tools? The debian, ubuntu, manjaro and others I have lying around are just the very basics. Am often missing something needed.
I seem to recall that Knoppix was a popular distro for repairing broken systems. This may be out-dated though. Also, ventoy is a tool that allows multiple bootable distros on a single USB stick, and I think allows some persistent storage. i.e. Use ventoy to install knoppix / whatever on a stick, boot the stick and install any missing tools, configure sshd, add scripts, etc., then next boot time everything ought to be available. I haven't yet tried this myself, just giving my 2¢ on how I'd approach things. rb
On Wed, 20 Sept 2023 at 15:16, BCLUG via talk <talk@gtalug.org> wrote:
bitmap via talk wrote on 2023-09-20 10:02:
Does this OpenSUSE image come with a broad range of tools? The debian, ubuntu, manjaro and others I have lying around are just the very basics. Am often missing something needed.
I seem to recall that Knoppix was a popular distro for repairing broken systems. This may be out-dated though.
Also, ventoy is a tool that allows multiple bootable distros on a single USB stick, and I think allows some persistent storage.
i.e. Use ventoy to install knoppix / whatever on a stick, boot the stick and install any missing tools, configure sshd, add scripts, etc., then next boot time everything ought to be available.
I haven't yet tried this myself, just giving my 2¢ on how I'd approach things.
I started using Knoppix about 25 years ago. Development has slowed, but there are still occasional releases - the most recent being 9.1 from 2021-01. It will boot on just about anything x86 or amd64 (at 4G or less memory it switches to a simpler interface ... it may even choke down to text mode eventually?), and come up to a fairly simple GUI with pretty much all the tools you could hope for. It remains my go-to for recovery and repartitioning. I'm still using v7.7.1 (2016 - LXDE interface) because that's what's on my bootable USB stick: it has thousands of tools, but ones I checked for today include 'inxi', 'gparted', and 'lshw'. Keep in mind this is the DVD version which has more tools than the CD version. Most of the command line tools are still on the CD, the bulk of the DVD space is for less interesting stuff like Libre Office. Ventoy sounds great, haven't tried it yet. I suspect raw Knoppix will boot on more machines than Ventoy, but that's idle speculation and a quarter century of success with Knoppix talking. http://knopper.net/knoppix-mirrors/index-en.html http://knoppix.net/get.php -- Giles https://www.gilesorr.com/ gilesorr@gmail.com
[Re-sending this message, didn't get copy. Apologies if duplicate.] bitmap via talk wrote on 2023-09-20 10:02:
Does this OpenSUSE image come with a broad range of tools? The debian, ubuntu, manjaro and others I have lying around are just the very basics. Am often missing something needed.
I seem to recall that Knoppix was a popular distro for repairing broken systems. This may be out-dated though. Also, ventoy is a tool that allows multiple bootable distros on a single USB stick, and I think allows some persistent storage. i.e. Use ventoy to install knoppix / whatever on a stick, boot the stick and install any missing tools, configure sshd, add scripts, etc., then next boot time everything ought to be available. I haven't yet tried this myself, just giving my 2¢ on how I'd approach things. rb
On 19/09/2023 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
I'd really like to have a good USB key to boot from when some kind of problem happens. Typically I use whatever installation media is lying around but they have really limited tools available. Not to mention tres obnoxious defaults like transparent terminals. Drive me nuts when some catastrophe is going on and the terminal is resetting to 50% opacity at every reboot.
Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand.
I use one usb https://www.ventoy.net/en/index.html You can drop on it multiple iso images to boot from. I use https://www.system-rescue.org/Download/ iso + other iso images like clonezilla and an live Ubuntu iso -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com
1. Use the distro iso to boot gui/text terminal. Most distros are "live", so you don't need a separate "rescue" disk. 2. Use Ventoy. It creates 2 partitions on USB stick, one Linux stuffs, and the other Windows partitions where you drop iso files. When you boot, you can select which iso you want to boot from. It works on some computers, but not all. On 2023-09-19 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
I'd really like to have a good USB key to boot from when some kind of problem happens. Typically I use whatever installation media is lying around but they have really limited tools available. Not to mention tres obnoxious defaults like transparent terminals. Drive me nuts when some catastrophe is going on and the terminal is resetting to 50% opacity at every reboot.
Is there some kind of general purpose image that has a variety of programs, maybe even foundational documentation on board, etc, that is designed for this? There are images like clonezilla to solve specific problems but that's another story. I would like a multi tool on hand.
My research tells me that by booting from USB media, it's possible to install on a connected drive of any sort. Normally you use the internal hd but can use another external drive. Then you have a persistent bootable USB where you can install stuff + store files. *However* it is unique to that device so it'd be required to set up a USB key for each one. Not ideal although possibly worthwhile for the main computer.
Any advice on this issue? Seems like I wouldn't have been the first person to have this idea. Is it a bad idea? Why? If not, how to set up?
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On 2023-09-19 23:22, bitmap via talk wrote:
I'd really like to have a good USB key to boot from when some kind of problem happens.
As was mentioned you can use a live CD/DVD. I use Linux Mint (although I'm thinking of moving to Debian testing) but it has the same issue that Fedora and other live images have and that is it doesn't have gparted. If you have an Internet connection it is a simple "apt get" away. One other option is to use Hiren's. The version I originally had booted in to a text only display and included lots of useful programs and tools for examining and fixing a machine. It has been updated to boot in to a graphical environment now. I don't know how current it is. You can find it at https://www.hirensbootcd.org/. -- Cheers! Kevin. https://www.patreon.com/KevinCozens | "Nerds make the shiny things that | distract the mouth-breathers, and Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172 | that's why we're powerful" #include <disclaimer/favourite> | --Chris Hardwick
participants (12)
-
Aurelian Melinte -
BCLUG -
bitmap -
D. Hugh Redelmeier -
Giles Orr -
James Knott -
joeDoe -
Kevin Cozens -
Nicholas Krause -
o1bigtenor -
Scott Allen -
William Park